I like “Live free, live rich” as well

or maybe even “Living rich and free”

JimK, while there are good people in the LP the bad ones are driving them out. Perhaps you’ve heard of what happened in Broward county, Florida?

Apparently this is even being sanctioned by state level officers. That’s a shame.

One of the founders of the Boston Tea Party – Jim Davidson – recently said – “The Libertarian Party is corrupt and disreputable. It is a bad thing when people contribute to the national party, or send membership dues to it, because it works evil, its staff misrepresent authoritarian positions as libertarian ones, and it thwarts effective efforts for liberty.”

It looks to be very similar in Florida. But maybe I am wrong. We will see.

However, I believe there is a solution…I used to call it the “Build the LP” until recent events opened my eyes…I’ve just got to come up with another name for it.

More on that later. After I clean up Cortlandt I will focus on the positive.

Thanks for the comments everyone!

Coming from the perspective of using a tool I would have to agree that we use any tools available to us whenever we do a job. It is always important to use the right tool for the right job.

It would be wrong to use a Republican to teach Libertarianism. That’s why Harry Browne would be a far better choice then Bob Barr. Yet the National decided to run with Bob Barr last year. I realize Harry is not with us anymore but they could have picked someone much more Libertarian then Bob Barr. They chose not to. Why not?

People will say that its because he was the one voted on at the convention. Yes, he was, but prior to that the platform changed to allow people like Barr to get in. He never would have made it through the door if the platform didn’t change.

What is happening with the party now? We didn’t increase our membership due to people learning about real Libertarianism, we increased it by lower our standards and people running from their home are finding a more palatable home here now.

Don’t believe it – then ask yourself, why is the Libertarian party saying that the Obama administration is right and we should secure our borders? That does not sound very Libertarian to me. We have water downed the soup to our own detriment.

What you see in the party now is what you get when you try to use the wrong tools for the wrong job. The platform was changed to make it more main stream, more like the other parties. We gave up our principles to be like them. We have become our enemy, all in the name of using tools.

Again, right tools for the right job. It is a lesson that evidently still needs to be learned today even though it has been taught for countless eons. When will people wake up?

We are talking past each other. I am suggesting to you only the narrow — and to me undeniable — point that in a world where libertarians are a minority, libertarians must necessarily conduct outreach to non-libertarians in our educational projects and work with non-libertarians in our political projects. Non-libertarians include, but are not limited to, Republicans. I am not making the case that Republicans as a group are libertarians or quasi-libertarians or anything else. If you insist on suggesting that I am, your critiques must necessarily miss their mark.
Again, my ideal is a 100% pure libertarian who looks around and uses the tools available to promote that vision.

Are you guys listening to yourselves? Okay, lets do this a different way. Last election cycle Bob Barr was running on the Libertarain ticket. Is he really a Libertarian or a republican?

When push comes to shove, one ALWAYS GOES WITH WHAT HE KNOWS – Bob Barr – is and always will be a Republican until he i seductaed in what it means to be a Libertarian.

The same with all the other wanna be republicans fleeing the republican party to find a home elsewhere in the Libertarian party. Why did we get a waterdowned party platform – what was wrong with the original one – oh yeah – i forgot – it wasnt center enough to let people like Bob Barr join our party.

What a crock, if you have to lower the standards instead of sticking to prinicple, then one is no better then the rest of the groups. The Libertarians have long stood out as the ONLY party of prinicple – giving that up means we now like them – who wants more of the same?

The biggest problem you need to deal with first is building a base. WIthout that base everything else is meaningless.

So Phil, let me ask you something, if you are a Libertarian and you are working with republicans because they are great help to our causes – how many of those republicans worked to build the base of the libertarian party – or maybe even an eaiser question – how many of them voted Libertarian last cycle and helped put a Libertarian into office?

building a base to a long term consciousness as a force in any context (political, activism, jury nullification, john galt style strike, etc.) probably needs real libertarian commitment to avoid excess infighting. build with the real thing when available.

The concentration camp is a nifty analogy but it doesn’t fit. Your next door neighbor who votes Republican is not a jailer. He may believe in invading foreign countries without a Congressional declaration but he has no control over you whatever and, indeed, might even be a nice, if misguided, person. If his wrong-headed view on foreign policy determines whether or not you will solicit his assistance in collecting signatures for a anti-tax referendum or something, then you are NOT serving principle but instead making yourself LESS effective in its promotion or defense.

The attitude that someone has to agree with you 100% in order to engage them is akin to the salesman who will only solicit those who already own their product!

My ideal is a 100% pure libertarian who looks around and uses the tools available to promote that vision.

I was wondering if you could clarify what you meant by “working with people who did not agree with us.”

Seems to me that is not necessary right now.

By that I mean the libertarian movement should be focused in other areas. (I can go into specifics if you would like. Just let me know.)

If you would like you may submit a guest post. That will allow you more room to reply than just the comment box.

A secondary but perhaps more inflammatory (but no less accurate, imho) question would be “just how do the prisoners in a concentration camp go about working with those who are keeping them prisoners?”

If we believe that libertarianism is a creed worth implementing, we should take every opportunity and avenue that is open to us to do so. We cannot put our personal animosities to take precedence over our commitment to liberty.